Comments on: 7 Reasons Your Filter Isn’t Improving Your Indoor Air Quality https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/ Building science knowledge, HVAC design, & fun Tue, 15 Sep 2020 18:43:55 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.6.2 By: Penny Carstens https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13458 Tue, 15 Sep 2020 18:43:55 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13458 In reply to abailes.

Thank you for clarifying. I
Thank you for clarifying. I had a feeling the ones showing up below after you mentioned them, weren’t the ones you wanted to connect with your information.
Now that I’m reading more of the comments here common I’m thinking of Putting efforts in a good air purifier.
If anyone can help with good choices of models I would appreciate it. I’m getting ads for them now that I am searching… so far the certified Bissell 320, the REME Halo (which fits on your existing furnace or air system, also whole home air purification services.
This is only my 1st couple of days exploring the stuff because of the smoke from wildfires but I will try and look through your threads or blog to find my own information on purifiers if you have them.

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By: abailes https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13446 Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:38:00 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13446 In reply to Penny Carstens.

Penny,

Penny,

No, the articles you named aren’t the follow-up articles I wrote in this series.  Here they are:

The Unintended Consequences of High-MERV Filters

Do High-MERV Filters Always Reduce Air Flow?

The Path to Low Pressure Drop Across a High-MERV Filter

How Often Should You Change the HVAC Filter?

And here are the filter articles I’ve written in 2020:

Can You Use HVAC Filters in Coronavirus Masks?

Can Your HVAC System Filter Out Coronavirus?

Understanding Filter Ratings:  MERV, FPR, and MPR

My Low Pressure-Drop, MERV-13 Filters

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By: Penny Carstens https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13444 Sun, 13 Sep 2020 22:55:58 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13444 At one point you mention, “My
At one point you mention, “My next three articles will explore this issue in depth and show you how to do it right.” on how high Merv filters decrease airflow.

I’ve quoted the articles that show up below. Are these them?

” Related Articles

This Thermostat Setting Can Cost You Money and Make You Sick

A Few of My Favorite Filter Photos

Asthma and Poor Indoor Air Quality — The Trouble with Homes

Which Indoor Air Pollutants Matter Most?”

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By: Kelly https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13373 Wed, 26 Aug 2020 20:28:21 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13373 The The “code regulated”
The The “code regulated” group just says “whatever meets the local codes for either ventilation or ERV/HRVs” claim would be a red flag for me, as to the competence of the expertise of the individual.

Take electrical, for example, many electricians hired to wire home hobby shops, because the owner recognizes his or her limited knowledge and ability, are more than happy to wire outlets with fourteen gauge wire, because that is all code requires in many places.

An expert who cares about his customer would know the customer needs 12 gauge for the extra five amps it can carry for tools and equipment.

Though I’m not an HVAC guy, I always went by the “I’m the expert and it’s up to me to educate my customers, as to what’s best for them, what their options are any why some options are better than others” approach.

Sadly, many so called pro’s know just enough to do the least required of them.

We don’t have to try to give customers enough information to make them our equals, but we can explain enough to plant valuable seeds [of thought] to help them help themselves in making decisions.

To the end of helping customers know they have options, it might be worthwhile to make a simple brochure explaining things like manometers and Magnehelic Differential Pressure Gauges, increasing air flow via pleated filters, pitfalls of higher MERV rating filters and so on.

From my experience, customers remember those who educated them. Even if the education could make you replaceable, they still wanted you to do the work, because you did take the time to educate them.

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By: Mike Vogeler https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13370 Wed, 26 Aug 2020 14:39:32 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13370 What is your take on 1″
What is your take on 1″ washable electrostatic filters that I wash and rotate (I have 2) every month. Mfg claims MERV 6. I have a washable MERV 13 that I put in occasionally on bad air days.

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By: David Eakin https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13361 Fri, 21 Aug 2020 19:33:14 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13361 Sarah – some of the very
Sarah – some of the very points I’ve tried to bring up w/o any definitive answers. One of the tenets to management is “you don’t manage what you don’t measure” and it seems like very few HVAC gurs/designers/technicians incorporate any reasonable cost/accuracy measurement plan. The Passive House movement seems to advocate the “outside air is always better” philosophy (but it isn’t where I and many others live). The “code regulated” group just says “whatever meets the local codes for either ventilation or ERV/HRVs” (still no measurement nor filter prescription). If you knew what was “bad” (i.e., is PM 2.5 really the target or PM .25)? What about ozone? And how much?) you could create an action plan for HVAC filters, air purifiers, ERV/HRV equipment. You could even build your own room air filter units. But you have to know what’s “bad”, and how “bad” YOU are first; then you will know if your efforts made things “better”.

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By: John Proctor PE https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13360 Fri, 21 Aug 2020 19:14:09 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13360 Sarah Well let me start with
Sarah Well let me start with the easy part MERV 10 is not a “hospital grade filter” Not sure there is such an animal. HEPA comes to mind but that is not really an option for your HVAC system. Note that the V stands for ventilation WHICH MEANS OUTDOOR AIR. So now we have the problems of the fires in the West. That then means the outdoor air is good because no virus, but bad because of PM2.5.
So unfortunately you are now stuck with filtration to mitigate the problem.
1) Unless you have had your duct system tested for leakage, do not run the fan continually to “filter” the air. Since ducts often leak and often quite a lot, they end up bringing in outside air with the wildfire generated PM2.5.
2) if you do have a “leakless” duct system have it modified to have more returns with much larger amount of filter area with 4″ to 5″ filter grilles using MERV13 or higher filters.
3) A low cost alternative if you do not know about your duct system is to buy a few cheap box fans, Duct tape MERV13 or higher filters to them and run them inside.
Here is an item I sent to contractors yesterday:
Ventilation, Covid19 and Filtration

There are often recommendations for dealing with the Covid virus that suggest, “increase ventilation”. Unfortunately for many of our customers they don’t know how to apply that suggestion since they are not real clear what ventilation is.

To clarify. Ventilation is outside air entering the space. THINK OUTSIDE!

Circulation on the other hand is moving air around within the space. THINK A FAN

So we want ventilation. We want to move air from outside into the space. There are standard and simple ways to move outside air into the space. 1) Open up windows. 2) Turn on bath and kitchen exhaust fans – moving air out of the house means outside air comes in to replace it. 3) Install and operate a window fan that helps make windows more effective. 4) There are more sophisticated systems that intentionally move outside air into and out of the house, often with heat exchangers between the two airflows.

OK so what about our customers ceiling fans, air conditioners, floor fans, furnace fans? These devices circulate indoor air, they do not dilute the concentration of the pollutant (the Covid virus). So, why do people use them? Because they make us feel cooler. Air moving across out skin causes evaporation, which makes us feel cooler.

Outside air is what we want to dilute the viral load in the building space. Sometimes customers do not have enough ways of obtaining adequate ventilation and we have to supplement the ventilation with Filtration. Filtration is definitely a second tier response to the problem. But not just any filter. HEPA or MERV 13 or higher.

Please note that these “high efficiency” filters are better at removing particulates, but they are also much more restrictive to airflow. To compensate for that we need to add additional return filter grills and revise the existing ones to accept 4” to 5” deep filters.

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By: Sarah https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13359 Thu, 20 Aug 2020 21:26:36 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13359 I’ve just moved out west and
I’ve just moved out west and the air quality has been quite poor, still only getting worse. I’m somewhat sympathetic to those advocating for better “layman” AQ sensors, although I appreciate the candor about accuracy since I was on the search for something. Trying to do *something* to hyper-locally mitigate all the persistent ambient pollution has been a chicken and egg conundrum trying to decide where to allocate limited resources. Baseline question: “Is the PM2.5 (for starters) worse indoors or outdoors?” Answer: no way of knowing. Regardless, if indoors can be well-scrubbed then I know it’s likely safer indoors, I thought. This blog has helped illuminate all the factors involved with “well-scrubbed”… It seems well-working HVAC system/filtration is preferable to air-purifiers for overall residential IAQ; however, where does a lay(wo)man begin? When I asked a local HVAC company guy who came to tune up the AC about filter quality, I was told the “system couldn’t handle” a 4″ filter (no mention of face area or pressure drop or anything else), and I wasn’t informed enough at the time to press further. So now I have a 1″ 16×25 (ostensibly) MERV 13, but from reading the blog, this 1″ may be doing more harm than a 4″. (?) And then there’s trying to find someone competent to assess all the duct work, pressure dropping, air flow, bypass, etc. to see what the system’s actual operational efficiency is like. And that all sounds like cruisin for a cash bruisin. So then I think, well for now if I get an air-purifier at least I know there will be one room where the air is non-toxic. But trying to make an educated air-purifier purchase with its own set of co-depending efficiency factors is proving just as fraught, again with no way of ultimately detecting/verifying any improved air quality results. It’s becoming clear that bang for your buck will fizzle unless there are enough bucks to create a big enough bang that all components involved in losing efficiency can be mitigated… IAQ is only as strong as the weakest link. And so we can’t afford with health to pay for placebo, but also can’t afford to ante up for an overhauled HVAC and it’s very hard to know which air purifier (if any) will actually yield results. It’s all very discouraging, and in the meantime knowing you’re still breathing day in/day out a good batch of toxins no matter where you are. I wonder if some kind of IAQ consultant would be the best place to invest… are there gurus out there for hire, no snake oil? At any rate (and rant), many thanks for this blog and helping some blind eyes to squint open.

As an aside, my mother is a schoolteacher and began school this week. They were told the schools had been updated with “hospital grade filters,” which sounded very comforting to all of us ignorants since teachers there have scant-to-none PPE for their rooms. I pressed her to inquire further of the custodian, who told her they would be “upgrading hopefully soon” to a MERV 10. Ironically, the kids aren’t allowed outside for recess right now due to bad air quality.

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By: John Proctor https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13274 Fri, 10 Jul 2020 22:25:55 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13274 George No that would not be
George No that would not be a good idea, the pressure drop would be too high and the airflow too low. Can’t figure out why a “standard” 4″ 16X25 filter would not fit. Perhaps you need to go on line to order one. Does your furnace also have AC? and how many tons is it or how many btuh is the furnace rated for? Where are you located?

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By: George https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality/#comment-13272 Fri, 10 Jul 2020 21:32:57 +0000 http://energyvanguard.flywheelsites.com/?blog_post=7-reasons-your-filter-isnt-improving-your-indoor-air-quality#comment-13272 I have a large 16x25x4 space
I have a large 16x25x4 space for my furance/HVAC filter. The standard 4″ filters at Lowes won’t fit but I could fit two 2″ filters. I was thinking about buying a Merv 8 and a Merv 13 and putting them in series. The Merv 8 would catch the large particles and the Merv 13 would catch the smaller particles. Is this a good idea?

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