Comments on: What Happens to Your Used Electricity? https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/ Building science knowledge, HVAC design, & fun Fri, 03 Feb 2023 23:17:12 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.6.2 By: Jim Matthews https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32719 Fri, 03 Feb 2023 23:17:12 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32719 In reply to Paul Szymkiewicz.

Regardless of energy savings, I would pay a hefty premium for a split refrigerator / freezer that eliminates compressor noise in my open plan kitchen / dining room / living room with wood floors…

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By: RoyC https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32682 Thu, 26 Jan 2023 21:44:49 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32682 In reply to Allison Bailes.

I have been involved with various past efforts to integrate various appliances to “recover” heat. One problem is that the loads do not usually match well. Your refrigerator cycles on-and-off, day-and-night. Your HPWH might only run a couple of times a day, but for longer periods of time. When the refrigerator is running, its heat output (Btu/hr) is much lower than what your heat pump needs for heat input. If your refrigerator is a new and efficient model, the air coming off the condenser is probably not that much warmer than the air in the room, so it wouldn’t help that much anyway, especially since the HPWH probably needs a larger airflow rate than what is leaving the refrigerator.

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By: Emmett https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32681 Thu, 26 Jan 2023 14:30:21 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32681 Paul,

Thanks for the link, I’ll follow up.

Conceptually I think I prefer to take the grid back from the current management structure and return it to communities.

But I am open to other thoughts.

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By: Allison Bailes https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32680 Thu, 26 Jan 2023 14:26:01 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32680 In reply to Emmett.

Emmett: Yes, feeling much better now! Mostly recovered from surgery, which was six weeks ago yesterday. All my bladder problems are now a thing of the past…since my bladder is also in that category. :~)

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By: Emmett https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32679 Thu, 26 Jan 2023 14:08:35 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32679 In reply to Allison Bailes.

Allison, good to see you typing, hope you are feeling better!
I need to do more reading, clearly.
Though must say when I told my better half about uncomfortably chilly basements and garages ( in some cases) she was interested in one in every room.
(Southern California desert residents and cooling is our greatest expense all year.)

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By: Paul Szymkiewicz https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32676 Wed, 25 Jan 2023 19:19:03 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32676 Emmet, here is a discussion on Green Building Advisor: https://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/question/will-we-ever-see-split-refrigerators

I like your idea of heat energy storage/sink under the house, especially in the context of getting towards grid independence. Until then, ground-source heat pumps are kind of doing that (often incorrectly called “geothermal”).

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By: Allison Bailes https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32675 Wed, 25 Jan 2023 18:48:34 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32675 In reply to Emmett.

Emmett: You capture that fridge heat with a heat pump water heater (HPWH). You don’t have to put the water heater in the kitchen to do it if get a HPWH that can be ducted.

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By: Emmett https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32673 Wed, 25 Jan 2023 15:17:45 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32673 The irony of my refrigerator blowing hot air into a hot room to make a cold space was never lost on me, and a house system can be scrutinized as little but moving heat from place to place.

So where do I go to buy a machine that delivers the excess heat from my cold box to my hot water tank? Stored heat to my cooking surfaces? I’m already pretty sure my fridge and hot water heater ought to be connected.

Perhaps two temperature reservoirs under my house, hot and cold; and heat pumps to shift it around as demanded?

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By: Luke m https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32672 Wed, 25 Jan 2023 05:54:40 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32672 I seem to remember a story that the headquarters of LADWP was not equipped with any space heating system but rather only an AC system. The building was designed with a lighting system that was sufficiently powered to satisfy the peak winter heating load, and temperature was controlled by modulating the AC.

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By: Gene DeJoannis https://www.energyvanguard.com/blog/what-happens-to-your-used-electricity/#comment-32671 Tue, 24 Jan 2023 21:40:28 +0000 https://www.energyvanguard.com/?p=8030#comment-32671 It’s fun to think about how various appliances convert energy to work and heat. Any motor converts 6-15% of its energy use to heat immediately, depending on its efficiency. But consider a well-pump. A good deal of its energy is going to lift the water from water table to the surface. That motor work stays in the well and is mostly lost to the ground, but some to the water too. But some of the motor’s work compresses air in the indoor storage tank and that work appears as heat lost from the tank to the space. Another curious case is a whole house fan pulling air from the house and pushing it out your attic vents. It’s motor efficiency loss, as well as air movement and attic pressurization energy eventually get lost as heat, but in your unconditioned attic or outdoors. But any appliance completely inside your space is going to add heat to it. What about a furnace fan? It’s tempting to say that the motor efficiency loss goes into the air, and the rest goes to the work of moving the air, but as Allison points out, the work of pressurizing the air heats it up and eventually all ends up as heat.

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